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Ёёёёёжииик! or I'm kinda lost
Thread poster: Lily von Wielligh (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Russian Federation
Local time: 01:58
English to Russian
+ ...
Jul 10, 2020

Hello, bright minds. I'm a complete newbie on this site and I must say i feel quite lost. I seem to begin wrapping my head around KudoZ, but there doesn't seem to be a simple article with the name "What is KudoZ and why do you need it". So may I ask you that question? From what I understand, it's a system that gives you points for answering other translators' questions, but only if the asker "gives" this point to you. Is that all there is to it? How crucial are those points? People seem to go a ... See more
Hello, bright minds. I'm a complete newbie on this site and I must say i feel quite lost. I seem to begin wrapping my head around KudoZ, but there doesn't seem to be a simple article with the name "What is KudoZ and why do you need it". So may I ask you that question? From what I understand, it's a system that gives you points for answering other translators' questions, but only if the asker "gives" this point to you. Is that all there is to it? How crucial are those points? People seem to go a bit ballistic about it, so I assume it's a coveted possession, those KudoZ points? Sorry if i sound like i just climbed out of a cave, I'm just trying to find my feet in this whole translation story O_oCollapse


Peter van der Hoek
 
Samuel Murray
Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 00:58
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Lily Jul 10, 2020

Lily von Wielligh wrote:
How crucial are those points? People seem to go a bit ballistic about it, so I assume it's a coveted possession, those KudoZ points?


Your position in a directory search depends on your KudoZ points total.


Lily von Wielligh (X)
neilmac
 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:58
Member (2008)
Italian to English
WRONG Jul 10, 2020

Lily von Wielligh wrote:

.....From what I understand, it's a system that gives you points for answering other translators' questions...


You misunderstand. Kudoz is a system for helping others with terms they find difficult to translate. Incidentally, it also awards points for the best answer chosen, but that is not its main purpose. Its main purpose is to enable you to assist others, and them to assist you. If you answer Kudoz questions with the sole aim of accumulating points, you're on the wrong track.

[Edited at 2020-07-10 14:09 GMT]


Thomas Pfann
Liviu-Lee Roth
Platary (X)
Sandra & Kenneth Grossman
Sheila Wilson
Tina Vonhof (X)
Lidija Klemencic
 
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Russian Federation
Local time: 01:58
English to Russian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
What is the right track then? Jul 10, 2020

If you answer Kudoz questions with the sole aim of accumulating points, you're on the wrong track.

[Edited at 2020-07-10 14:09 GMT] [/quote]

Thanks, Tom. Are there any other ways to accumulate points then? I want to improve my position in the directory as it is probably rock bottom currently


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:58
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Attracting clients Jul 10, 2020

If your aim is to attract clients, you should offer translation in a very specialised field where the number of your competitors is greatly reduced. Do you offer any particular specialisation?

[Edited at 2020-07-10 14:21 GMT]


Sheila Wilson
Aline Amorim
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
 
esperantisto
esperantisto  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:58
Member (2006)
English to Russian
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER
The article Jul 10, 2020

https://www.proz.com/faq/kudoz.html

DZiW (X)
Yolanda Broad
Aline Amorim
 
Sheila Wilson
Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 23:58
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Site Guidance Centre Jul 10, 2020

Hi and welcome to ProZ.com. As said, KudoZ points are key to getting yourself a good directory position, as they are used for sorting our profiles. All paying members come before any registered users, but within your set entries are ordered by KudoZ points. However, few clients will search simply for a translator; they'll limit their search with all manner of filters. In that case, your specialisations and the category your KudoZ points come from become even more important. So, say you particula... See more
Hi and welcome to ProZ.com. As said, KudoZ points are key to getting yourself a good directory position, as they are used for sorting our profiles. All paying members come before any registered users, but within your set entries are ordered by KudoZ points. However, few clients will search simply for a translator; they'll limit their search with all manner of filters. In that case, your specialisations and the category your KudoZ points come from become even more important. So, say you particularly specialise in RU>EN religious texts. Amass some points for that and you might soon get to the first page and even into the top spot for those searches. If your profile and your CV both give details of your experience in that subject, you could become the goto person after a while. That's the theory, anyway .

Check out the Site Guidance Centre for help on making the site work for you. And get yourself booked on the free Meeting Clients webinar. You can check your directory position and get hints on improving it too.

KudoZ isn't meant to be a competition, it's a community support resource, and you'll lose the respect of your peers if you simply chase points. Fellow freelancers are also sometimes outsourcers, so your reputation on KudoZ is worth a lot. So give well-researched answers with sufficient references.
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Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
Lily von Wielligh (X)
marijaflora
 
Jo Macdonald
Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 00:58
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
Methinks Jul 10, 2020

WWA reviews from clients and maybe also presence online/forum posts or how helpful you're considered, how nice you are or whatever were also added to the mix a while back to calculate how high you ranked in the listings as just kudoz isn't a very fair way to rank folks, but as far as I can tell kudoz points are still the dominant factor when it comes to who appears first.

Personally I reckon WWA reviews from happy clients are something potential new clients will definitely check whe
... See more
WWA reviews from clients and maybe also presence online/forum posts or how helpful you're considered, how nice you are or whatever were also added to the mix a while back to calculate how high you ranked in the listings as just kudoz isn't a very fair way to rank folks, but as far as I can tell kudoz points are still the dominant factor when it comes to who appears first.

Personally I reckon WWA reviews from happy clients are something potential new clients will definitely check when they see your profile and probably wouldn't even know what a kudoz was if it bit em on the... Then again if you're not on the first page cause ya got no kudoz...catch 22.

Anyway if you specialize in a rare language pair and nuclear engineering you should fight your way to near the top of the heap pretty quick. In the "Translators" directory search every now and then for nuclear translators in your language pair to see how you're doing and to make sure you show up in searches as some profile settings can make you invisible to all and sundry.

My advice is not to get hung up on kudoz questions and I agree the spirit of the whole thing should be to help pro colleagues and get good bilingual terms in the glossary even if they're not picked by idiots and get no pointies. Helping people doing translations they're not qualified to do ...not so much.

Nowadays I just add an occasional answer I consider better than the ones that got the points to questions closed ages ago. There are some right stinkers out there.

Have fun
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Yolanda Broad
Tom in London
Aline Amorim
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Hugh Thomson
Tina Vonhof (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
 
The Misha
The Misha
Local time: 19:58
Russian to English
+ ...
Never mind saving the world Jul 10, 2020

The true value of Kudoz for you as the "answerer" is in that they let you demonstrate your knowledge and skills for everyone to see. That is, of course, if you have any. If you don't, you might as well stay away because on an online public forum where most folks do not know each other personally they use what you say and how you say it to form an opinion, conscientiously or not, about your professional qualifications. Under the circumstances, they simply have nothing else to rely upon. A lot of ... See more
The true value of Kudoz for you as the "answerer" is in that they let you demonstrate your knowledge and skills for everyone to see. That is, of course, if you have any. If you don't, you might as well stay away because on an online public forum where most folks do not know each other personally they use what you say and how you say it to form an opinion, conscientiously or not, about your professional qualifications. Under the circumstances, they simply have nothing else to rely upon. A lot of those willing to jump at every Kudoz question posted fail to appreciate this and hurt themselves badly in their colleagues' and potential clients' eyes by offering totally asinine answers that make it abundantly clear they are simply not up to par. Don't get me wrong, I am sure most of these upstanding individuals are sheer delight in all other respects, but that's not what this is about. Above all else, this is about showcasing your skills. How about you try an experiment: ask a colleague you know who has been around this place long enough who the good, the bad and the ugly ones are. They'll tell you - without ever bothering with the number of points, LW whatevers, Red Ps and what not. Like any other "credentials," real or imaginary, these are essentially useless. What we practice here is a craft. No one cares if you have a piece of paper. What they want to know is whether you can do the job.

By all means, try your hand at Kudoz but be very, very mindful about what you say - especially if you are offering translations into a language that you have not been born with.

Good luck to you.
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Sheila Wilson
Michele Fauble
Marina Taffetani
Susan Welsh
Daryo
 
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Russian Federation
Local time: 01:58
English to Russian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
The more the better? No? Jul 11, 2020

Tom in London wrote:

If your aim is to attract clients, you should offer translation in a very specialised field where the number of your competitors is greatly reduced. Do you offer any particular specialisation?

[Edited at 2020-07-10 14:21 GMT]


Well, I'm just starting, so I figured I'll put a lot of specializations on the list, at least each that I have any experience in. Wrong thinking? A lot of jobs are restricted to certain specializations, so even if it's my language pair and I qualify otherwise, this factor blocks me out.But even with a lot of specializations I haven't managed to get one order from this site so far...


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:58
Member (2008)
Italian to English
YOUR specialism Jul 11, 2020

Lily von Wielligh wrote:

Tom in London wrote:

If your aim is to attract clients, you should offer translation in a very specialised field where the number of your competitors is greatly reduced. Do you offer any particular specialisation?

[Edited at 2020-07-10 14:21 GMT]


Well, I'm just starting, so I figured I'll put a lot of specializations on the list, at least each that I have any experience in. Wrong thinking? A lot of jobs are restricted to certain specializations, so even if it's my language pair and I qualify otherwise, this factor blocks me out.But even with a lot of specializations I haven't managed to get one order from this site so far...


That's not what I meant - all Prozians choose from a list of specialisations, when compiling their profile. What I mean is a much more particular specialism: an area or field in which you personally are very knowledgeable.

[Edited at 2020-07-11 11:25 GMT]


Lily von Wielligh (X)
neilmac
 
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Russian Federation
Local time: 01:58
English to Russian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Is a low price a good idea? Jul 11, 2020

Personally I reckon WWA reviews from happy clients are something potential new clients will definitely check when they see your profile and probably wouldn't even know what a kudoz was if it bit em on the... Then again if you're not on the first page cause ya got no kudoz...catch 22.

That's the thing, I cannot get reviews until I can get orders. And to get orders, a client must chose me, and why would they. Would you say putting a really low price is a good strategy, or does it make
... See more
Personally I reckon WWA reviews from happy clients are something potential new clients will definitely check when they see your profile and probably wouldn't even know what a kudoz was if it bit em on the... Then again if you're not on the first page cause ya got no kudoz...catch 22.

That's the thing, I cannot get reviews until I can get orders. And to get orders, a client must chose me, and why would they. Would you say putting a really low price is a good strategy, or does it make a client suspicious? Like, if the standard for my pair is o.1 USD, I would put 0.02 USD
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Kay-Viktor Stegemann
Kay-Viktor Stegemann
Germany
Local time: 00:58
English to German
In memoriam
A race to the bottom has no winner Jul 11, 2020

Lily von Wielligh wrote:

That's the thing, I cannot get reviews until I can get orders. And to get orders, a client must chose me, and why would they. Would you say putting a really low price is a good strategy, or does it make a client suspicious? Like, if the standard for my pair is o.1 USD, I would put 0.02 USD


A "really low price" mainly shows that you are desperate. Are you? Of course there are lots of agencies there who only look for the lowest rate they can get away with, but these are the agencies where the business model is based on exploiting people and make a quick buck. This kind of clientele can be expected to use every other means to cheat you as well, like dragging payments until the cows come home or finding excuses not to pay you at all. And of course you will compete against others who simply had the same idea and just offer to do it for half your rate, whatever you quote. The idea that you would get warm recommendations from this kind of clientele is also not very promising.

If you really need some starting points, it would be wiser to work for free for charities like Translators without Borders and collect some experience and feedback there.

But in the long run, you need a professional and sustainable approach. You need clients and agencies that choose you because you are the best choice, not because you are the easiest one to walk over. And for that, you need that much quoted "unique selling point", something you can do better than the majority of your competition. In most cases, that is a select choice of specializations that are (hopefully) in high demand. Most clients are well aware that "I specialize in everything!" actually means that you have no particular specialization.

[Edited at 2020-07-11 12:03 GMT]


Christel Zipfel
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Jo Macdonald
Dan Lucas
Tina Vonhof (X)
marijaflora
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
 
Jo Macdonald
Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 00:58
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
For what it's worth Jul 11, 2020

Sitting on the beach one day along comes this friendly African-looking bloke selling his wares. "Vu compra?" he asks with a toothy smile. "Rolex?" he offers. I give the watch a gander, looks like a Rolex, says Rolex on the case, tells the time too, and I need a new watch. "How much?" I ask. "100 quid," he say still smiling his toothy grin. "100 quid for a fake Rolex!" I retort, "you must be bloody joking mate..." anyway, after hours of haggling I eventually knock him down to a ridiculous price t... See more
Sitting on the beach one day along comes this friendly African-looking bloke selling his wares. "Vu compra?" he asks with a toothy smile. "Rolex?" he offers. I give the watch a gander, looks like a Rolex, says Rolex on the case, tells the time too, and I need a new watch. "How much?" I ask. "100 quid," he say still smiling his toothy grin. "100 quid for a fake Rolex!" I retort, "you must be bloody joking mate..." anyway, after hours of haggling I eventually knock him down to a ridiculous price that probably won't even pay the shipping from deepest darkest China or wherever else twas made, we settle on 30 queen's heads on the nose, a little less of a toothy smile from the seller, a bit more weight on me arm, and I've got me a brand new Rolex.
But I haven't have I?
Even if it tells the time for years, and the paint don't rub off tomorrow, and no one else can tell it's not a real Rolex, I know it's not and one of the reasons I know it's not is cause it just cost me 30 bucks instead of 5 thousand or God knows how much a real one should.

The point is, if you sell something cheapo it's value is going to be cheapo for he/she who buys it for ever more, even if it does the job (even looks almost exactly the same) it's just not as good. Aaaaaaaaaand, the toff wanting a real Rolex wouldn't ever buy one for 30 quid would they? There's loads of African-looking blokes selling em for 50-40-30-20 quid and they all tell the time, but the toff who wants the real deal will get up off the beach and go to the Rolex shop down the high street (maybe the one with the best offer/service/whatever) to get the real thing.

So good, high-paying clients look for the best at a fair price and go to THAT particular shop to get it; anyone looking for cheapo rubbish that just barely does the job will shop around for the cheapest deal and not really care how good what they get is as long as it costs next to nothing.

In the translating games there are big cheapo agencies who want jobs done for yesterday, use (yes "USE") grossly underpaid translators like cannon fodder or gears in a machine, they're always hiring "updating their resources" cause no one can survive for long on the peanuts they're paying, and the work they produce might be sold as quality but probably ain't. On the other side of the fence there are Pros who've built up their reputation for years and pride themselves on doing the very best job possible, they work for smaller agencies who pay better and mostly stick to their high-ish rates, cause otherwise they wouldn't make a living. There are also some quite good translators who work for very low rates, I suspect have no time for life and drag the market down for all involved. Everyone chooses where they want to sit on this fence. Personally I'd rather work less and earn more.

Oh and even better than all that caboodle above is the ever-elusive direct client, not easy to find this one but if you're in Moscow then trade fairs are a great place to start, for interpreting too. Direct clients pay better, it's more of a one-on-one relationship, and they want that special YOU if they do, so you can charge as much as you want, more or less. You get the idea. Contact them face-to-face or over the phone, not by mass spamo e-mail.

You can find decent agencies searching the Blueboard, again a phone call is better before sending a mail.
Contact translators in your language pair to ask about rates and collaboration.

[Edited at 2020-07-11 13:26 GMT]

[Edited at 2020-07-11 13:27 GMT]
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DZiW (X)
Lily von Wielligh (X)
Sheila Wilson
Christel Zipfel
Catherine Brix
 
Stepan Konev
Stepan Konev  Identity Verified
Russian Federation
Local time: 02:58
English to Russian
Aha! Jul 11, 2020

Sheila Wilson wrote:
KudoZ points are key to getting yourself a good directory position

Finally, I understand what I did wrong. Over many years on proz.com, not a single potential employer ever tried to contact me. Even though I submit quotes... Even though I often comment posts on this forum... However, I never tried fiddling with kudoz
Now I doubt about paid membership even more, when I know that kudoz is the key...


[Edited at 2020-07-11 13:55 GMT]


 
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Ёёёёёжииик! or I'm kinda lost






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