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English translation: force majeure such as state interventions
10:41 Jun 4, 2020
German to English translations [PRO] Bus/Financial - Law: Contract(s) / AGBs
German term or phrase:höhere Gewalt wie hoheitliche Eingriffe
Treten auf unserer Seite oder bei unseren Vorlieferanten Ereignisse außerhalb unserer Einflussmöglichkeiten auf, z. B. höhere Gewalt wie hoheitliche Eingriffe, Aus- und/ oder Einfuhrverbote, Arbeitskämpfe in eigenen und fremden Betrieben, Verzögerung oder Ausfall der Anlieferung wesentlicher Rohstoffe, Materialien oder Teile, Maschinenschaden oder Stromausfall, verlängert sich die Lieferfrist - auch bei bereits bestehendem Lieferverzug - angemessen.
My question is about the 'wie'. I can't work out if it means 'such as' or if it is a connector with the meaning of 'and'. I am inclined towards the former, but am doubting myself.
Explanation: "Also strike, lock-out, mobilisation, war, blockade, export and import bans and other state intervention are deemed to be force majeure regardless of whether they occur on our part or on the part of our supplier." https://www.doehler.com/en/terms-conditions.html
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 49 mins (2020-06-04 11:31:17 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
"Der höheren Gewalt stehen Streik, Aussperrung, Mobilmachung, Krieg, Blockade, Aus- und Einfuhrverbote und sonstige hoheitliche Eingriffe gleich, und zwar einerlei, ob sie bei uns oder unserem Lieferanten eintreten." https://www.doehler.com/de/agb.html
Thanks again for your help, I graded based on peer agrees, although Leighton and Michael were equally as helpful. 4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer
There should be an option to split points, as everyone here has been very helpful in the discussion and has put forward good solutions. My job description here was simply to update the existing older version of the English with the tracked changes in the new German version. As such, I agree that the English is overcooked, and so I have asked the client to clarify their intended meaning, just to be sure. As I'm sure everyone knows, lawyers and grammar do not always get along ;-)
That's a good point, "e.g. force majeure such as" is certainly poor style. I think you could potentially get around this issue though by using different words and rephrasing, perhaps using "including" to start the list?
How many of the following elements are included (hoheitliche Eingriffe, Aus- und/ oder Einfuhrverbote, Arbeitskämpfe in eigenen und fremden Betrieben, Verzögerung oder Ausfall der Anlieferung wesentlicher Rohstoffe, Materialien oder Teile, Maschinenschaden oder Stromausfall)? There are quite a few mentioned. In fact, it seems to be an exhaustive list of what constitutes force majeure. And just look at those three 'oders' later on. 'Or' for each of them in English? After all, their use is quite *deliberate*.
How will you deal with z.B. in the English version? "z.B. ... wie" may be acceptable to a German reader (surprised there isn't an "unter anderem" for good measure at the end of the sentence) but "for example ... such as" sounds overcooked in English.
Yeah, I would agree. I imagine the company has changed the comma to a "wie" for precisely this reason and to make it clear that it now considers state intervention as force majeure.
I also agree with you both on "state intervention" as the best solution here for "hoheitliche eingriffe".
Think in terms of this era of sanctions, blockades, embargoes etc and state intervention would have to be deemed force majeure for business interests....
Force majeure though varies across legal systems, so while it commonly refers to floods, earthquakes, hurricanes, etc. it can also include acts of war, terrorist activities, labour disputes, interruption or failure of electricity or communications systems, etc.
I would definitely use "such as" given that it must have been changed for a reason, which you have to assume is to demonstrate that government acts will now be considered force majeure.
I should add, that this job is to update an older version of the AGBs, whereby the person editing the text deleted the original comma and added the word 'wie'. Hence my doubts as to whether this is another item in the list...
'höhere Gewalt' is just an item in the list along with the others. The author may have forgotten/overlooked that the list is introduced by 'z.B.'. Google search (with double quotes) reveals that this is standard phrasing for contracts.
Automatic update in 00:
Answers
22 mins confidence: peer agreement (net): +2
force majeure, public authority interventions
Explanation: Possibly an error because this seems to be a set phrase and almost never appears with "wie" but rather a comma instead
E.g. "Treten Leistungshindernisse außerhalb der Einflussmöglichkeiten des Verkäufers auf, z. B. höhere Gewalt, hoheitliche Eingriffe, Aus- und/oder Einfuhrverbote, Arbeitskämpfe" (https://www.lettsfit.de/agb.html)
Besides, I don't think government acts can generally be considered force majeure?
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 42 mins (2020-06-04 11:24:00 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
As it was purposefully changed from a comma to "wie", I would now suggest using "such as" because you have to assume that the company is thereby specifying that government acts will be considered force majeure.
Leighton Jacobs United Kingdom Local time: 10:47 Native speaker of: English
Notes to answerer
Asker: That's exactly my conundrum, the editor of the source text removed the comma and added the 'wie', so I guess my question is whether government acts are considered force majeure? Possibly a question for the author.
45 mins confidence: peer agreement (net): +6
force majeure such as state interventions
Explanation: "Also strike, lock-out, mobilisation, war, blockade, export and import bans and other state intervention are deemed to be force majeure regardless of whether they occur on our part or on the part of our supplier." https://www.doehler.com/en/terms-conditions.html
-------------------------------------------------- Note added at 49 mins (2020-06-04 11:31:17 GMT) --------------------------------------------------
"Der höheren Gewalt stehen Streik, Aussperrung, Mobilmachung, Krieg, Blockade, Aus- und Einfuhrverbote und sonstige hoheitliche Eingriffe gleich, und zwar einerlei, ob sie bei uns oder unserem Lieferanten eintreten." https://www.doehler.com/de/agb.html
Chris Pr United Kingdom Local time: 10:47 Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 12
Grading comment
Thanks again for your help, I graded based on peer agrees, although Leighton and Michael were equally as helpful.