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English translation: There was no fumbling for words,
18:07 Aug 15, 2015
Italian to English translations [PRO] Idioms / Maxims / Sayings / industrial history
Italian term or phrase:Non c’era la declinazione del verbo inglese
I really do not understand this phrase in the context. All I can think is that it means that there was no deviation, no 'beating about the bush' so to speak.... any offer of illumination most welcome!
Paragraph: La loro idea si concretizzava in un manufatto, in una macchina, ed era quella la sintesi del loro pensiero. XXX Non c’era la declinazione del verbo inglese.XXX Non c’erano divagazioni. C’era il manufatto, l’oggetto e la funzione dell’oggetto, e questa è davvero una lingua internazionale. Parlavano delle stesse cose, magari chiamandole in un mondo diverso, ma si capivano.
Explanation: In my opinion, this has nothing to do with English verbs, it refers to the fact that they knew what they wanted. I believe this is a way of saying that they were not hesitant, "la declinazione del verbo inglese" is a synonym of not being able to find the right words.
I am saying this because of the next sentence: Non c’erano divagazioni: which refers to what you wrote "No beating about the bush"
I would translate it as There was no fumbling for words, no beating about the bush
If you don't like this translation you could probably say "Hems and Haws" which refers to hesitation as well.
Following the discussion with colleagues, I will be going for my original guess: there was no beating about the bush... but your suggestion basically says the same thing, so I am awarding you the points! Thanks as always to everyone for their invaluable contributions 4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer
For the most part, English verbs have no conjugation. I went, you went, he went, we went, you went they went: so the conjugation (as I used to teach it many years ago to make the point about the absence of conjugatons) is "went, went, went, went, went, went". Perhaps the author is also being ironic. They didn't mess around with stupid formalities.
We seem to be talking the same language and saying the same thing without understanding each other: "... since the objects themselves spoke an international language that was understood by everyone. The idea is more like bare essentials / back to basics / no frills..." This I can agree with, they didn't beat around the bush trying to conjugate verbs in a foreign language, they, they just concentrated on the bare essentials without any frills. However, if you translated literally in English noboby would understand, while it is pretty clear in the Italian. And obviously it has to be a metaphor, since this is about manufacturing not grammar.
@judy. Thanks for your suggestion but, no: it has nothing to do with chair design or with the exhibition UDESIGN. The protagonists of the piece are Edison and Malignani who met in New York in the late 19th century. What the writer is trying to stress here is that while neither spoke the other's language, they nevertheless understood each other - both were scientists, both were excited about the scientific and technological progress the modern age offered. This formed the basis of the understanding between them - they didn't need complicated language (verb structures) to communicate... in reality of course they almost certainly employed the services of an interpreter... but that's another (less 'romantic') version of the story!!
As a metaphor, it means nothing to an Italian and can only be explained by pointing to some shared reference, which I think could well be UDESIGN (also considering where manducci is working from). The point, I think, is that we're talking about the craft (as opposed to the "art") of making furniture, before it became a fancy "design" thing, when you didn't need English as an international language, since the objects themselves spoke an international language that was understood by everyone. The idea is more like bare essentials / back to basics / no frills
...but only manducci can tell, perhaps after asking the client
The metaphor here, is that they did not conjugate the verb looking at all the different persons singular and plural and all the different tenses. They just looked at verb (presumably the infinitive" and its meaning, or in the context "l'oggetto e la funzione dell'oggetto". Of course broader interpretations of "verbo" (idea, discourse) and of "declinazione" (analysis) can be used, but the result here is the same.
UDESIGN, la mappa dell’Industria di Design in Friuli Si scrive UDESIGN, si legge YOU DESIGN. Il titolo dell’iniziativa gioca su un doppio significato: da una parte lo stemma della città di Udine utilizzato nel logotipo della mostra indica il territorio del capoluogo friulano come area privilegiata di un’inedita indagine sull’industria; dall’altra la declinazione del verbo inglese suona simultaneamente come affermazione e incoraggiamento.
It's not a fixed expression in Italian and English verb conjugations are very simple compared to Italian or French (Present 3rd pers. "s"; Past no change, etc, Fut., no change; Conditional, no change). So it don't think it's about not being able to find the right words/fumbling for words/beating about the bush.
I really do not think refers to the Verbo. I thank you for your efforts in explaining the origin of the Verbum. But for those who at Liceo CLASSICO translated such texts: Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ λόγος, καὶ ὁ λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν θεόν, καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος. It is really pointless.
No I don't believe that the word here refers to the scriptures. I just quoted perhaps the most famous use of the term "Verbo" where it is translated into English with the term "word" and not "verb".
Yes, I agree and my solution suggests exactly what you have said 'no redundant, extra details added'. I do not believe that 'word' here refers to the Scriptures, otherwise it would be probably written in capital letters (as you wrote it). Then of course we have no context at all, but in my opinion somehow the literal register clashes with idiom, 'this form of hunting'..
il Verbo era presso Dio e il Verbo era Dio. In Italian the word verbo can also mean word, or opinion, or school of thought. Similarly "declinazione" is also used figurativel in the sense of examination or analysis. Consequently this is just a way of saying there is no unnecessary examination of irrelevant details.
To Phil and Jim: Arturo Malignani and Thomas Edison. Jim: the XXX is to mark/isolate the key phrase - I'll leave it out next time if it confuses the issue;-)
è "chiamandole in un "mondo" diverso o in un "modo" diverso? Interessante che si faccia riferimento alla 'declinazione' (solo NOMI) e non alla 'coniugazione' tipica dei VERBI.. Quindi è una trovata con 'licenza letteraria'. In più il riferimento è al ME e/o EModE.
What product are we talking about? And who are the people referred to?
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Answers
6 hrs confidence:
There was no attempt to adapt the English verb
Explanation: From the context it would seem that no attempt was made to change/adapt the English verb through a declension because it was understood that all that mattered was the object (una macchina) that was produced. It might help to know more about the subject matter of document as a whole.
NinaBullard United States Local time: 11:06 Native speaker of: English, Italian
Explanation: In my opinion, this has nothing to do with English verbs, it refers to the fact that they knew what they wanted. I believe this is a way of saying that they were not hesitant, "la declinazione del verbo inglese" is a synonym of not being able to find the right words.
I am saying this because of the next sentence: Non c’erano divagazioni: which refers to what you wrote "No beating about the bush"
I would translate it as There was no fumbling for words, no beating about the bush
If you don't like this translation you could probably say "Hems and Haws" which refers to hesitation as well.
Following the discussion with colleagues, I will be going for my original guess: there was no beating about the bush... but your suggestion basically says the same thing, so I am awarding you the points! Thanks as always to everyone for their invaluable contributions
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