Fuad Yahya Aug 9, 2020:

I get your point, Karina. I am familiar with نظم being used for stringing beads, as you explained, and by extension, for lining up or arranging components into a system. For instance, the writing of poetry according to traditional schemes with all lines following a uniform rhyme and meter is called نظم, and a poet who practices in this tradition is often called ناظم (which is also used as a personal name). Like you, I have never seen the word used for threading a needle.

The issue, though, is لضم (and لظم): Is this the threading of a needle, or is this the stitching of a wound? It would be easy to figure out if we knew to what object the word لها refers in the sentence لا يوجد لها استخدام, because the pronoun in لضمها, by conjunction, refers to the same object as the pronoun in لها. I don't see how the sentence لا يوجد لها اسـتخدام could refer to a wound, so that leaves me thinking that it could only refer to a needle. That is deduction by elimination, which only gives a tentative solution. Of course, all of this confusion could be dispelled if the asker would only provide sufficient context. I am sure the preceding parts of the text are explicit about the object to which this pronoun refers.

adel almergawy Aug 4, 2020:

@ Morano Elkholy : I totally agree with you.

adel almergawy Aug 4, 2020:

@ to me , most the answers here are correct despite using different vocabulary, they have the same meaning like( require/ necessities/ necessary). It is an urgent matter to use the verb : agree

Karina Zidan (X) Aug 3, 2020:

Just quick note that لضم and نظم don’t mean ‘thread a needle’; just threading, as in also beads (ضم نظم). Threading a needle is تمرير/تسليك الخيط في الإبرة or سم الإبرة. The usage we’re discussing is coneventional.

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

I am skeptical, Rasha. Here is why:

1. I don't see how the threading of a needle could be called ضمّ.

2. I can see how لضمّ could be changed to لَضم, but that would presume the appropriation of the word from written texts, not from the spoken medium. That strikes me as unlikely. Even if it were possible, I don't see how, of all the possible morphological derivations and combinations of the root ضمّ, the Egyptians chose لضمّ rather than the simple root ضمّ.

3. If the Egyptians had really chosen لضمّ first and then got the urge to "lighten" لضمّ, it would have been a lot simpler to revert to the root ضمّ. After all, the word ضمّ is commonly used and easily understood by Egyptians.

For these reasons, I find this etymological theory a bit overreaching. It fails Occam's razor's test. But I agree that "threading" is the likeliest meaning, even if we can't figure out how the word came to be. It might be a corruption of نظم or not.

Rasha Ellithy Aug 3, 2020:

@Fuad Yahya
I am glad I could help. If it helps any, I think may be لضم was originally لِضَمّ and as usual the Egyptians tend to "lighten" the words of Fusha in their dialect. Just my opinion.

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

Oh, Rasha, that is interesting. If لضم is synonymous with the Egyptian لظم, which, as Karina theorized, could be a colloquial corruption of نظم, we can reasonably conclude that the object discussed in posted sentence is an old-style surgical needle that requires making a knot.

In truth, the first question that crossed my mind when I read the sentence قررت اللجنة أنه لا يوجد لها استخدام was: to what object does the word لها refer? That is the question I wanted to ask, but than I noticed the word لضم, which puzzled me even more. Now, it makes perfect sense, but I still think the asker should have clarified that.

Karina Zidan (X) Aug 3, 2020:

Ignore last comment. Was wrong again.

Karina Zidan (X) Aug 3, 2020:

لظم I was wrong. Had a hunch and looked up لظم. https://www.maajim.com/dictionary/لظم الخيط

Rasha Ellithy Aug 3, 2020:

@Fuad Yahya In the Egyptian dialect the women use the term لضم in sewing to indicate atraching or passing the thread through the eye of the needle. That is why my understanding of the text is attaching something to the thread ( most likely a surgical needle), hence the need to make a knot lest the thread slips from the needle.

Karina Zidan (X) Aug 3, 2020:

It seems to be from ضم. I’ve always known لضم, but thought it Egyptian; first time I see it in writing. Threading in فصحى is نَّظْم root نَظَمَ, as in ضم الشيء إلى الشيء. Have a look here: https://www.google.nl/amp/s/www.arabdict.com/amp/results?lan...

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

لضم It means like انضمام الخيط in its literal meaning, but the intended meaning is stitching up or suturing the surgical suture ...
لضم الخيط بمعنى استعمال الخيط من أجل جمع الجرح إن صح التعبير

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

The page does not show a relevant entry Under the title لضم الخيط, the page shows three entries: خياط, خياطة, and خيط. There is no entry for لضم, and none of the three entries mentions لضم or provides a definition.

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

معنى لضم الخيط في معاجم اللغة العربية. قاموس عربي عربي. لضم الخيط. جذر [(لضم ),(خيط

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

I followed the three links, . . . but I could not find the word لضم anywhere on those pages.

Morano El-Kholy Aug 3, 2020:

Further useful links. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8oWv-nVO6g

https://www.artofmanliness.com/articles/how-to-suture-a-woun...

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

Link https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https:/...

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

I have already been stitched up ... by a surgical suture due to a minor bike accident😂, but it wasn't bad.

Anyway, " معنى لضم الخيط في معاجم اللغة العربية. قاموس عربي عربي. لضم الخيط. جذر [(لضم ),(خيط)]"

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

Thanks, Morano and Yassine. I have never seen this term before, and it does not show in my searches. You guys must have had surgical experience.

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

عند لضمها بالخيط الجراحي When stitching it up with a surgical suture

Yassine El Bouknify Aug 3, 2020:

The committee has decided that it is clueless in modern medicine: قررت اللجنة أنه لا يوجد لها استخدام في الطب الحديث
ما هو الشيء الذي لا يوجد له استخدام؟

Morano El-Kholy Aug 3, 2020:

@ Fuad Yahya Wound suturing. والله أعلم

Fuad Yahya Aug 3, 2020:

لضمها What does لضمها mean?