Si es importante . . . y en la práctica

23:33 Feb 4, 2013 

Thanks for putting so much time and thought into this challenge. I'm touched! I've decided to select James' answer. I think he has really caught the essence of what they're trying to say. Here is my translation stands at this point:

'While/whereas it was important for the lands to be turned over to the communities, the fact is/what has happened is that these communities in turn have divided up the land and given each of their members either a parcel of their own or a shared interest in it, and this process has generated the need to update the titles.'

12:02 Feb 4, 2013 

Difficult to be certain here, as the source is, I insist, quite poor (or very poor, to put it mildly). In either case, a change is necessary in the original phrase, and since we have no access to the author to ask it is Muriel who has to solve the doubt. The question in fact is, I agree with you on this, whether the clause is affirmative or not. This is the key point.

11:44 Feb 4, 2013 

That certainly reads better! However, the core question is whether "Si" should be "Sí" or whether "y" should be omitted. Either of these alternatives produces a grammatical result. You have defended the former, as has Claudia, and Frutos also suggested it. One attraction is that it involves the minimum intervention: just an accent. However, I would defend the latter: "Si" as is and cut "y".

The reason is that there is an implicit adversative relationship between the two parts of this sentence. Indeed, Claudia seems to have sensed this too, since she said "although" in her explanation. This is consistent with "Si", which would mean "While", in the sense of "Although", but not with "Sí"; if you read "Sí es importante", the second half ("y en la práctica"...) reinforces the first rather than qualifying it.

The idea in the previous sentence is that handing the land over to the indigenous population should reduce the problem of "actualización de títulos". But this sentence says that although the handover has been important, in practice it has made that problem worse ("genera falta de actualización"). Therein lies the adversative element.

11:22 Feb 4, 2013 

This is how I read the original:
Para la propiedad de la tierra en terrenos indígenas se presentan básicamente los mismos problemas antes señalados, pero en una menor medida, debido a que se realizó recientemente, (...), la entrega de tierras indígenas a las comunidades, con lo que se disminuye drásticamente el problema de la actualización de títulos. SÍ es importante** que las tierras SE HAYAN ENTREGADO a LAS Comunidades, **y en la práctica** estas comunidades se han ido dividiendo y HAN IDO entregando a cada uno de sus integrantes una parte o cuota del terreno, lo que genera falta de actualización de propiedad de la tierra.

10:40 Feb 3, 2013 

Yes, it's a humourous way of saying goodbye in the UK... I use it all the time. Typically it would be "Right, I'm off. Toodle pip!" But it's true, the isms of our language variants are really quite different (and often funny too).

01:32 Feb 3, 2013 

Is that English? (smile) I'm always surprised at how much common ground we Americans and Brits find in discussing our translations, when in fact we speak quite different languages.

23:40 Feb 2, 2013 

Toodle pip! :)

23:22 Feb 2, 2013 

One of the keys, I think, is that the opening clause should be in the past: 'Whereas/while it *was* important to turn the lands over to the communities, the reality/fact of the matter is . . .'

23:13 Feb 2, 2013 

Indeed! You're right. You have caught the full connotation.

21:46 Feb 2, 2013 

I like your interpretation a lot, Muriel, but can’t help thinking there’s a subtle connotation missing somehow...

I understand “Si es importante que [...] y en la práctica” as something along the lines of “Whereas it is important [...] the truth of the matter is”. I get the feeling it’s trying to imply that the process is proving trickier to control (administratively) since the lands were turned over to the communities. But the Spanish is poorly constructed, without a doubt. Perhaps “whereas” would work? Consider: http://tinyurl.com/ctuhwsn

Just a thought... :)

21:40 Feb 2, 2013 

Imho you (and James) got it right. "en la práctica" could also be expressed as "..., these communities have actually divided up..."

21:08 Feb 2, 2013 

Thanks for thinking about this! I'm sticking with 'while', and I agree that it should have been past subjunctive. The "y" is confusing, and I'm not sure "en la práctica" adds very much. So this is what I have written (which is close to what James proposed):

'While it was important for the lands to be turned over to the communities, these communities in turn have divided up the land and given each of their members either a parcel of their own or a shared interest in it, and this process has generated the need to update the titles.'

13:51 Feb 2, 2013 

I totally agree with you! The conjunction should not be there, or else there is a typo in "Si".
Actually after reading your corrections I am leaning towards James´s answer...

13:13 Feb 2, 2013 

My reaction is the same as Frutos': there seems to be something wrong with the text here. Two things, in fact. First, "Si es importante que las tierras se entregaron a Comunidades" should surely be "[...] que se entregaran a Comunidades"; it should be subjunctive after "es importante que". Second, as Frutos says, the sentence as it stands lacks a main clause, and I think the answer may well be that "y" should not be there. In other words, it makes sense to me like this:

"Si es importante que las tierras se entregaran a Comunidades, en la práctica estas comunidades se han ido dividiendo y entregando a cada uno de sus integrantes una parte o cuota del terreno, lo que genera falta de actualización de propiedad de la tierra."

If that's how it should read, then James's answer is correct, I think.