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English translation: as if in the hands of other people
GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Portuguese term or phrase:
em poder das pessoas
English translation:
as if in the hands of other people
16:05 Jan 29, 2018
The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2018-02-02 15:54:08 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Portuguese to English translations [PRO] Law/Patents - Law: Taxation & Customs / Tax declaration
Portuguese term or phrase:em poder das pessoas
This is from a Brazilian Parliamentary investigation into corruption among a certain group of people/companies. It is referring to the investigation of tax declarations pertaining to the individuals in question and is from the following passage:
"O processo aponta que a análise das declarações de imposto de renda (DIRPF) do sócio XXX e de sua esposa XXX revelam uma origem de recursos suspeita, com grandes volumes de moeda declarados como em poder das pessoas."
I'm struggling to understand what "em poder das pessoas" means exactly, and to come up with a good translation into English.
I've just received a reply from my client concerning the "pessoas" ambiguity, which doesn't really help us I'm afraid :-( It turns out that the author of the original text is not someone they have direct contact with, and the report is from a while back, so they are unable to get any further specification. We're going to attach a little note with the translation to explain the ambiguity and possible interpretations. Not very helpful for the awarding of points I know! Thanks again for your help.
I appreciate if you could post whatever you find out about "pessoas" after talking to your client. I believe this information is crucial for the community to pick the right answer. Thank you in advance and good luck with your translation. :-)
Hi everyone! Looking at what Soraya and Gilmar have just said, I think this is actually a case of the text being pretty ambiguous, which explains why it confused me so much in the first place. I have actually written to my client to see if I can get further clarification of exactly which "pessoas" we're referring to. In the meantime, after reflecting a little more, I've actually gone for a much more ambiguous translation in English, avoiding "pessoas" altogether and simply putting "...with large volumes of currency declared as being held." Not ideal, but probably the best compromise at present. As for the awarding of points, it's a hard one isn't it - I wish I could spread them as you've all been really helpful in figuring out what to do. Will let the community decide. Thanks again to you all for your very valuable help.
just to add my two cents, sometimes some text interpretation is really needed and indeed the source is bad written. However, the analysis is said to be done on the tax declaration of the 2 persons mentioned. And the purpose is often very simple in Brazil or elsewhere: if you have substantial fortune declared that does not correspond of your salary/earnings that is suspicious. If it is the estate belong to someone else, that wouldn't be the case. As we cannot have access to the whole text, I would find Marios solution safe because it makes sense. The couple has declared a state in their tax declaration which is therefore suspicious. "a análise das declarações de imposto de renda (DIRPF) do sócio XXX e de sua esposa XXX revelam uma origem de recursos suspeita"
Thanks for all your help. I was a bit thrown by the ambiguity of "das pessoas", as there were no obvious clues/references before or after the sentence. However, later on in the text, it goes on say: "A operação é apontada com indícios de “ocultação do sujeito passivo, real adquirente da mercadoria”, which fits perfectly with Oliveira's explanation - I think that's mystery solved. Thank you all!
I would find it really strange if someone who's now suspicious of tax fraud would have declared that they are the holders of the money/assets in question. Most likely, they assigned ownership to somebody else in order to avoid paying taxes. It sounds like another example of tax evasion. To me, it makes more sense to infer that the tax filers are acting AS IF this money doesn't belong to them! Note: The source-text refers to "em poder das pessoas" (undefined) rather than "em poder destas pessoas" (defined).
Indeed, we can't be really sure based on the context. However, in this case I'd still prefer "held by" than "in the hands of", as the former surely indicates possession, while de latter usually indicates a responsibility (temporary AMOF). I.e.: You are the holder = proprietário, titular - o bem está em seu poder It's in your hands = you are responsible for it, but not necessarily the owner.
Yuriy Vilner (X)
United States
"das pessoas"?
18:07 Jan 29, 2018
"em poder" is simply "held by" or "in the possession/control of", as Mario indicated. But without knowing the identity of the 'pessoas', we can only speculate. Just in my own experience on similar translations, I'd guess that the funds are held by legal entities set up by the declarants, in which case I'd translate as 'as held by legal entities' or 'as held by these/such legal entities' if there's a reference to them in the immediately preceding sentence or two ...
Perhaps check the 2 immediately preceding sentences for clues?
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Answers
17 mins confidence: peer agreement (net): +1
as if in the hands of other people
Explanation: em poder de: in the hands of (Reverso Dictionary)
Example sentence(s):
A large percentage of the nation's wealth is in the hands of a very, very few people.
Replete with coyotes, dog-headed gods and broken tractors, In the Hands of Anubis is a wonderfully playful exploration of human relationships...
peer agreement (net): +1
