Oct 28, 2023 20:57
8 mos ago
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русский term

Pushkin Square or Pushkinskaya Square?

русский => английский Прочее Юриспруденция (в целом) Court Decisions
Should urban objects' (streets, squares, etc.) names be translated into English as they look and sound in Russian? Pushkinskaya Square or Pushkin Square?
Proposed translations (английский)
5 +3 Pushkinskaya

Discussion

Vladimir Dubisskiy Nov 13, 2023:
mk_lab Oct 29 100% correct With mk_lab on Если исходное название "площадь Пушкина", то "Pushkin Square". А если "Пушкинская площадь", то "Pushkinskaya Square".
David Knowles Nov 5, 2023:
It depends! Often wikipedia entries are a help For example, the official English names are given in Wikipedia. Thus I would probably translate Тверская Область as Tver Oblast. That avoids awkward (in English) adjectival endings, but I also agree with The Misha that the main thing is to be consistent. It also depends on the formality of the document - here it's a translation of a court decision, so it may need a higher level of precision, even at the expense of awkwardness.
The Misha Oct 29, 2023:
It matters none whatsoever Either version will work just fine as long as you stay consistent throughout. There are no clear-cut rules in English that govern transliteration of foreign names. Folks really have more important things to worry about.
mk_lab Oct 29, 2023:
Какой-то абсурд и в вопросе, и обсуждениях Если исходное название "площадь Пушкина", то "Pushkin Square". А если "Пушкинская площадь", то "Pushkinskaya Square".
Есть и те, и другие:
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Площадь Пушкина (Иваново)
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Пушкинская площадь
О какой из них идет речь, так и следует переводить/транслитерировать.
Какие тут могут быть варианты?
Oleg Lozinskiy Oct 28, 2023:
И почему "ПушкинСКАЯ" -> "PushkinSKAYA"? А не, скажем, "PushkinSKAIA" -> https://www.google.ru/search?newwindow=1&sca_esv=577502368&q...
Oleg Lozinskiy Oct 28, 2023:
A question to: Vladimir Alekseev, MCIL А в чем состоит "the purpose of translation" данного текста? В вопросе это не указано.

Как всегда: где "КОНТЕКСТ"???

Proposed translations

+3
11 мин
Selected

Pushkinskaya

The names should not be translated, they should be transleterated.

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Note added at 12 mins (2023-10-28 21:09:52 GMT)
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*translIterated - sorry, a typo :-)
Peer comment(s):

agree Vladimir Alekseev, MCIL : Конечно транслитерированы. Иначе у Вас будет "The Lane of the Unbowed" вместо "проспекта Непокоренных", что напрочь defeats the purpose of translation : )
47 мин
Thank you!
neutral Oleg Lozinskiy : Так считают не все -> https://shorturl.at/kyzP8 | В вопросе не указано, что переводится "почтовый адрес". См. также: http://address.mosopen.ru/22460-104019 и https://cih.ru/3d/m10.html
50 мин
А надо просто представить себе того гипотетического почтальона, который будет этот адрес по-английски разбирать :-)
agree Olga Sinitsyna
2 час
Thanks!
agree Boris Shapiro : При такой категории вопроса - да. В литературе или публицистике - нет
9 час
Thanks!
neutral mk_lab : А если имеется в виду вот эта площадь? https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Площадь Пушкина (Иваново)
12 час
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Спасибо всем комментаторам! Речь шла о Пушкинской площади в Москве, в тексте Петиции на статус политического беженца. Я перевёл Pushkinskaya Square, но хотел быть уверен."

Reference comments

1 час
Reference:

For reference:

Pushkinskaya Square or Pushkin Square (Russian: Пу́шкинская пло́щадь) is a pedestrian open space in the Tverskoy District in central Moscow. Historically, it was known as Strastnaya Square (Russian: Страстная площадь) before being renamed for Alexander Pushkin in 1937.[1][2]

It is located at the junction of the Boulevard Ring (Tverskoy Boulevard to the southwest and Strastnoy Boulevard to the northeast) and Tverskaya Street, 2 kilometres (1.2 mi) northwest of the Kremlin. It is not only one of the busiest city squares in Moscow, but also one of the busiest in the world.

The former Strastnaya Square name originates from the Passion Monastery (Russian: Страстной монастырь, Strastnoy Monastery), which was demolished in the 1930s by the Soviet regime.

At the center of the square is a statue of Pushkin, funded by public subscription and unveiled by Ivan Turgenev and Fyodor Dostoyevsky in 1880. In 1950, Joseph Stalin had the statue moved to the other side of the Tverskaya Street, where the historic Passion Monastery had formerly stood. On 5 December 1965, Glasnost Meeting, the first spontaneous public political demonstration in the Soviet Union after the Second World War, took place here. In January 1990, the first McDonald's restaurant in Soviet Union and largest one in the world at that time opened here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pushkinskaya_Square

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Note added at 1 hr (2023-10-28 22:38:21 GMT)
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And, for example, in Odessa a street under the same name is described as:

Vulytsia Pushkinska (Ukrainian: Пушкінська) is a street in the downtown of Odesa, Ukraine. The street is named after Russian poet Alexander Pushkin, who lived on the street. The street starts from the Dumska Square and finishes at the crossing with the Panteleymonivska Street. The street was founded in 1827.

The street was founded as Italian Street (Ukrainian: вулиця Італійська, vulytsia Italiiska). It was named after Pushkin on June 25, 1880, and the street saved the name until now. Although Pushkin lived in several different buildings at different times, the Museum of Pushkin (the branch of the Odesa Literature Museum) was organized at Pushkinska Street 13. The statue of Pushkin was founded at the front of the building dedicating to the 200th-year jubilee of his birthday.

Many famous architecture monuments are located on the street; among them are Abazy Palace (now the Odesa Museum of Western and Eastern Art), the New Burse Building (now the Odesa Philharmonic Theater), and the Bristol Hotel.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pushkinska_Street,_Odesa

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Note added at 2 hrs (2023-10-28 23:27:33 GMT)
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В добавление:

Страстная площадь

Она же — Пушкинская

Самая многострадальная площадь старой Москвы — та, где стоит в окружении фонарей памятник Пушкину. Ее пространство двести лет застраивали, украшали и разрушили в минувшем веке на моих глазах, нанеся последние удары в 1960–1970-е годы. История площади началась в Средние века, с деревянных Тверских ворот в земляном оборонительном валу. В конце XVI века его заменили каменной, побеленной известкой стеной, получившей название Белого города. Воздвиг мощную крепость, окружавшую всю Москву, поражавшую иностранцев неприступностью и размерами, «государев мастер» Федор Иванов, по прозвищу Конь, отличившийся при трех царях: Иване Грозном, Федоре Иоанновиче и Борисе Годунове.
https://www.mk.ru/moscow/2012/06/06/712253-strastnaya-plosch...
Note from asker:
Thank you for historical references. Btw, I’m from Odessa, and though I’ve been living far away from it for the last 30 yrs, for me Pushkinskaya is my favorite street in the whole world… And, of course, I know a lot about its (and Odessa in general) history. My question was related to the location in Moscow, not mailing address. I am translating testimony accompanying a Refugee Status Application, describing some events that took place at Пушкинская площадь. Fifferent Internet resources offer both Pushkin Square and Pushkinskaya Square, as well as Pushkinskaya Ploschad. Amazingly, the last one is on the Google Map of Moscow downtown, next to “Tverskaya Street”. No consistency. It seems to be just a matter of translator’s taste…
Peer comments on this reference comment:

agree Frank Szmulowicz, Ph. D.
33 мин
My most profound appreciation, Frank!
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