This site uses cookies. Some of these cookies are essential to the operation of the site, while others help to improve your experience by providing insights into how the site is being used. For more information, please see the ProZ.com privacy policy.
Cookie settings
8 hours\' presence
mainstream
Aug 16, 2017 09:09
6 yrs ago
2 viewers *
English term

American and America

Non-PRO English Other History military
Help please. I have a long Dutch-English text about Americans and their entry into the First World War.
The Dutch text constantly says America (for the country) and talks about the American army (to quote just one example).
Is it correct to stick with the Dutch American/America or should /could I use US (adjective) /United States for elegant variation?

Were they more likely to say American/America during that period and did the US/United States formulation become more prevalent during the Second World War?

I wrote to ask an American friend, who said I could use the words interchangeable but thinking back to conversation with him and other American friends I think they always said something like back in the States!!!

Any suggestions gladly welcome.

Anton
Responses
5 US
4 -1 amerikaans en Verenigde Staten
Change log

Aug 16, 2017 13:28: philgoddard changed "Language pair" from "Dutch to English" to "English"

Aug 16, 2017 14:46: Kirsten Bodart changed "Level" from "PRO" to "Non-PRO"

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (3): writeaway, Textpertise, Kirsten Bodart

When entering new questions, KudoZ askers are given an opportunity* to classify the difficulty of their questions as 'easy' or 'pro'. If you feel a question marked 'easy' should actually be marked 'pro', and if you have earned more than 20 KudoZ points, you can click the "Vote PRO" button to recommend that change.

How to tell the difference between "easy" and "pro" questions:

An easy question is one that any bilingual person would be able to answer correctly. (Or in the case of monolingual questions, an easy question is one that any native speaker of the language would be able to answer correctly.)

A pro question is anything else... in other words, any question that requires knowledge or skills that are specialized (even slightly).

Another way to think of the difficulty levels is this: an easy question is one that deals with everyday conversation. A pro question is anything else.

When deciding between easy and pro, err on the side of pro. Most questions will be pro.

* Note: non-member askers are not given the option of entering 'pro' questions; the only way for their questions to be classified as 'pro' is for a ProZ.com member or members to re-classify it.

Discussion

writeaway Aug 19, 2017:
talk about overkill this is a real cake-taker
Björn Vrooman Aug 19, 2017:
Look what I've found Went back to Google because I was curious:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/black-womens-health-and...
http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2013/04/an-african-ameri...

Even these more recent links (as yours is from 2005) say the same, basically. Some style guides even require that you use ""black"--albeit as an adjective, mostly. It's just as a noun that it may sound odd to some; same as "America," I guess.

Best
Herbmione Granger Aug 18, 2017:
@Björn From my experience, "Black" is preferred now, even by people who probably have African ancestry. It is a new identity. Of course, the *tone* used when referring to this group of people is important. Interesting question. This is how officials define the racial groups: (PDF) https://www.usaid.gov/sites/default/files/Form-SF-181-Aug200...
Björn Vrooman Aug 18, 2017:
@herbalchemist Funny, that's what I had in mind too. Technically, "United States" could refer to two countries in North America (NAFTA borders).

Don't know what you or Sheri think, but after having followed US politics for about a decade, I cannot confirm Textpertise's statement here: "morphed first to Black and then to African American." It's what I've been taught too, but I discovered that this isn't very accurate. A lot of people on TV (whether the channel leans left or right politically) do speak of "Blacks" and BLM (Black Lives Matter) isn't called AALM either. What's more, M-W has quotes from newspapers and websites using black/Black without this being some kind of anti-PC statement:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/black

I merely wanted to add this because jethro may need it (cf: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_African_Am... ).

Additionally:
http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/congress-renames-...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2190155/Thomas-Jeffe...

I wouldn't worry too much about using "United States" and "America" interchangeably.
Herbmione Granger Aug 17, 2017:
American history When the U.S.A. claimed indepence and wrote its constitution, it was the only recognized nation in America/the New World, so the rest of the world called it "America." "America" is still used for the nation/country, and the New World is now referred to as the Americas (North, Central, South). Canada is not part of America; it is part of North America and the Americas. I don't know why any Canadian would want to be referred to as "American." "U.S." was also used during WWI dakinarchives.net/iphoto/wwIcartoons/Desktop.html Also interesting: funtrivia.com/askft/question87572.html
Isn't "United States" more self-assuming than "America"? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_(disambiguation)
Björn Vrooman Aug 16, 2017:
@jethro I thought it's seven continents for Americans anyway, i.e., the Americas.

I've once read a blog entry (I think it was on "Separated by a Common Language") about the word "American" and the point is that unlike "America," where you could say United States/USA, you don't really have a choice when it comes to the people and only one alternative for the adjective (U.S. in AP style). While people from Colombia hail from a nation located in South America, they're called Colombians; same with Chileans, etc. But "Americans" will only be the ones born in the States. There is the rare form of "US American," but it's nonstandard.

Cf:
https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/87645/can-i-use-...

By that logic, an American submarine is unlikely to be confused for a Brazilian one.
jethro (asker) Aug 16, 2017:
Interesting posts. Thanks very much.
Sheri P Aug 16, 2017:
In the US today, 'America' and 'the US' are definitely not interchangeable, at least for educated speakers. 'America' has a somewhat nationalist ring to it, the kind of term politicitians of all stripes throw out on the campaign trail or that Fox News proudly uses any chance they get to show their in-your-face anti-PC attitude. I'd be careful about when I use that term in a modern text. If you're trying to replicate an earlier form of American English, that's a different story I suppose.

Interestingly, I don't think the adjective 'American' has the same nationalist connotations.
Tina Vonhof (X) Aug 16, 2017:
I agree with Textpertise. You should be faithful to the historical context and say America and the Americans. Today America and the US are used interchangeably in the media, by politicians, etc. but in regular conversation people still say America and Americans.
jethro (asker) Aug 16, 2017:
Silly I did not think of it before but I just found a Wikipedia post about “American entry into World War I “ only to discover they use America/United States, American/US interchangeably. So presumably not a Dutchism or Britishism! Thanks for your patience.
Textpertise Aug 16, 2017:
Political correctness In that period, America and American would have meant the US. People in the US had a certain kind of arrogance (still do) about their country. In the late twentieth century, it became "the thing" to be politically correct and nomenclature underwent a sea change. For example, words like Negro morphed first to Black and then to African American. It is only in the late twentieth/early twenty-first century that a certain sensitivity has begun to emerge about the fact that using "America" to designate the US only ignores the existence of other countries in America besides the US (such as Canada, Mexico and all the Central and South American countries). If you want to be politically correct in our times, you should use US or United States. If you want the translation to reflect the historical usage at that time, use American and America.
jethro (asker) Aug 16, 2017:
Thanks for your answer. Although I am not sure it is just a Dutchism. I tend to say America a lot for the country and I am English (albeit an older one). And I do see some book titles saying such things as the American Army during the First World War. I appreciate that Canadians and South Americans are Americans but I am thinking more in terms of what would sound right to American (as in United States ears).

Responses

5 days
Selected

US

"U.S. president Donald Trump" "the US army"

to differentiate, as others have said, from the rest of us North Americans
Note from asker:
Thanks a lot
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
-1
3 hrs

amerikaans en Verenigde Staten

One could say: “President of United States” (formal) or “the American President” (casual). It is interchangeable, depending on fluency of text.
Peer comment(s):
neutral writeaway : one is an adjective, the other the name used to refer to the country. Not interchangeable in English. Interchangeable in Dutch perhaps
2 hrs
disagree Edith Kelly : English to English question
3 hrs
Something went wrong...
Close search
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search