| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Is it practical to use two CAT Tools or more? Thread poster: Tzviya Levin Rifkind
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Some translation companies are not happy to dixcover that I'm not using the tool for which their files are intended (like TTX for TagEditor of Trados or TXML for WordFast) and in the case of a technical problem they immediately blame it on my tool. Some other companies have asked me to start using a cloud tool (XTM).
Working with two tools will cause splitting of my TMs and glossaries, which will be different for each tool.
If you have any experience of working with two... See more Some translation companies are not happy to dixcover that I'm not using the tool for which their files are intended (like TTX for TagEditor of Trados or TXML for WordFast) and in the case of a technical problem they immediately blame it on my tool. Some other companies have asked me to start using a cloud tool (XTM).
Working with two tools will cause splitting of my TMs and glossaries, which will be different for each tool.
If you have any experience of working with two CAT tools or a CAT tool and a cloud tool I would really appreciate if you share it with me. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | My case against more than one CAT tool | Nov 4, 2012 |
[which I listed here: http://www.proz.com/forum/cat_tools_technical_help/228988-different_cat_tools_for_different_clients-page2.html]
- Price: CAT tools cost money, some of them a lot of it. Buy/use one CAT tool that does it all and is affordable. In a lot of cases, it's not only the purchase price t... See more [which I listed here: http://www.proz.com/forum/cat_tools_technical_help/228988-different_cat_tools_for_different_clients-page2.html]
- Price: CAT tools cost money, some of them a lot of it. Buy/use one CAT tool that does it all and is affordable. In a lot of cases, it's not only the purchase price that counts, but also updates, upgrades, and/or "subscriptions."
- Time: Every CAT tool has its learning curve, and some learning curves are very steep. Don't invest time (=money) in it. Buy/use one CAT tool that does it all.
- Convenience: Switching tools requires you to change the way you work. Just think of different keyboard shortcuts.
- Our rates: Our rates are plunging. Why invest in extra tools when we get paid less? And on top of that, why spend money on tools that contribute to our lower rates or even triggered them?
- Freedom: Some tools require the use of one particular operating system, and worse, the purchase of an office suite. In the case of Windows and MS Office, we're talking serious money at that. I don't like that. I'm a Mac. Buy a tool that is cross-platform and that is stand-alone, so when you finally switch to the best OS, you don't have to invest in other software and in time to learn yet another tool.
Cheers,
Hans ▲ Collapse
| | | | | n-tools, if required | Nov 4, 2012 |
Hello Tzviya,
this is my experience: I work with several agencies, but my core business is with 3 of them, and each one uses a different CAT tool (namely: Wordfast Pro, MemoQ, Trados). There are other agencies I work with occasionally, but 90% of the time I am told which CAT I should use (often Trados, in some instance XTM, one asks for POEdit, another for QTLinguist).
They don't feel comfortable if I use a CAT that should be able to handle with their file format, as in... See more Hello Tzviya,
this is my experience: I work with several agencies, but my core business is with 3 of them, and each one uses a different CAT tool (namely: Wordfast Pro, MemoQ, Trados). There are other agencies I work with occasionally, but 90% of the time I am told which CAT I should use (often Trados, in some instance XTM, one asks for POEdit, another for QTLinguist).
They don't feel comfortable if I use a CAT that should be able to handle with their file format, as in case of technical issues they know nobody is gonna help them (unless you can sort it out by yourself). The CAT-company of the file format doesn't offer support if you translate their files with another CAT, and the CAT-company that you use, in the best case will offer their help, but this will come late and may no solve your issue (i.e. you will be told "this is a bug still to be fixed").
Plus, the compatibility has its limits, the biggest one is server-related: if you are working with a remote TM or a remote project, you must have the CAT tool, as compatibility does not go that far.
That said, CAT works all the same way, and on a basic level it is not that hard to switch from a CAT to another.
Serious agencies will lend you a license for the time required to complete the project, so that you don't have to ask for a loan to afford all of them! ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Handling split resources | Nov 4, 2012 |
Hello Paola,
How do handle the issue of splitting the TMs and glossaries? Do you have any trick to combine these resources?
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| Second and third CAT tool for conversion purposes | Nov 4, 2012 |
I do indeed prefer to use the tool of my choice for my work, but I do possess licences of a few other tools and I use them to convert the work my clients send me into a format that can be processed by my tool (mostly xliff-based presently) and to check (and eventually solve the issues of) the finished translation, so the client can still be sure that the tool of his choice was used. I find that the latter is gaining importance these days, since - as Paola said - compatibility has its limits. Hav... See more I do indeed prefer to use the tool of my choice for my work, but I do possess licences of a few other tools and I use them to convert the work my clients send me into a format that can be processed by my tool (mostly xliff-based presently) and to check (and eventually solve the issues of) the finished translation, so the client can still be sure that the tool of his choice was used. I find that the latter is gaining importance these days, since - as Paola said - compatibility has its limits. Having a second licence also has the advantage that you have something to fall back on if your "first love" goes on strike. Happened to me once or twice. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | I don't have a personal TM | Nov 4, 2012 |
Tzviya Levin wrote:
Hello Paola,
How do handle the issue of splitting the TMs and glossaries? Do you have any trick to combine these resources?
I know this sounds odd, but I never had my own TM.
The agency I work most with sends me file, TM and glossary every time, as they have a wide pool of linguists working for all of their clients. To avoid sending TMs, they started to use remote TMs, but remote TMs work only with the native CAT tool (in this case, Wordfasto Pro).
However there are workaround to allow you to build your own TM: you can export the TM generated in the various CAT tools into *.tmx (the exchange format for TMs). (Note, you cannot do this with remote TMs).
To overcome the various language variant in the TM (for example, the agency from the UK sends me TMs in the EN-UK-IT pair, while the one from the US sends them in the EN-US-IT pair) you can open the TMX with notepad and find/replace EN-US to EN-UK or vice versa.
The point is... even if you can do it, it is too time consuming. If you are lucky enough to deal with direct clients or if you are simply able to choose a CAT, then stick to it.
Unfortunately this is not my case.
| | | | LEXpert 
United States
Local time: 17:49
Member (2008)
Croatian to English
+ ...
| TMs in two tools | Nov 4, 2012 |
Tzviya Levin wrote:
Hello Paola,
How do handle the issue of splitting the TMs and glossaries? Do you have any trick to combine these resources?
If on a certain occasion you find yourself working outside your main tool, it only takes a few minutes to export a TM (say, your master TM) from your main tool to tmx, and import it into whatever tool your client wants you to use.
When you are done, export your project TM from the 2nd tool and import it into your master TM (or other TM) in the main tool. Now your TMs in the main tool are up-to-date.
I too have found that the nominal/claimed compatibility of various tools with other tools does not always equate to full compatibility in practice. Often it's easier to simply comply with the client's request (if it's a tool that I have), rather than have to extensively de-bug the final product.
| | | | | I wish things were so simple. | Nov 4, 2012 |
Rudolf,
I use a different TM for each client. It means, that if I want to update a TM from one CAT to the other I must do it together with the end of a project. Otherwise I will forget which is the most updated TM, on CAT 1 or CAT 2.
Since many times I work on several projects during a short period of time (e.g. 3-4-5 projects during 3 days) and also might have some urgent short jobs, I don't want to end up updating TMs all day long and certainly not lose content of a T... See more Rudolf,
I use a different TM for each client. It means, that if I want to update a TM from one CAT to the other I must do it together with the end of a project. Otherwise I will forget which is the most updated TM, on CAT 1 or CAT 2.
Since many times I work on several projects during a short period of time (e.g. 3-4-5 projects during 3 days) and also might have some urgent short jobs, I don't want to end up updating TMs all day long and certainly not lose content of a TM. ▲ Collapse
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Heinrich Pesch
Finland
Local time: 01:49
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
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It hardly ever happens that the TM from client A is of any use for jobs of client B, even in the same language combination. I must have translated hundred of times the security instructions in technical manuals, every writer phrases the stuff in his/her own words. So the source segments are almost 100 % new every time.
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I have 3 different tools, and I find it really difficult to switch. Despite some great features in the 2 tools I hardly use, the learning curve is an issue and I don't have much free time to spend reading manuals and fiddling around like I did in the early days of my business. I regret the money spent on one tool in particular. I like the comfort *my* CAT tool, and when I do have to use another one, I am always worried about unexpected technical issues cropping up.
In my case, the v... See more I have 3 different tools, and I find it really difficult to switch. Despite some great features in the 2 tools I hardly use, the learning curve is an issue and I don't have much free time to spend reading manuals and fiddling around like I did in the early days of my business. I regret the money spent on one tool in particular. I like the comfort *my* CAT tool, and when I do have to use another one, I am always worried about unexpected technical issues cropping up.
In my case, the vast majority of my clients have no preference as to which tool I use, so I mostly stick to my favorite.
I disagree with Heinrich's comment. Of course I don't get 100% matches (or even fuzzy matches) from one project to the next, but I do use context search extensively. For example I have translated difficult words/phrases over the years in various contexts on various projects in different fields, and with a simple shortcut, I can pull up all of those instances and choose the one that best fits my current context, without having to agonize over it or search any further. To me, that is the true value of my TM. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: empty |
Tzviya Levin wrote:
Working with two tools will cause splitting of my TMs and glossaries, which will be different for each tool.
But I hope you have different TMs and different glossaries for different end clients.
I work with three tools, two of them in two formats (a standalone tool and a Word plugin), so in fact five tools, and from time to time without a tool, for instance when translating PDF files.
Besides, I have two source languages.
Workaround:
- for the TMs: from the beginning they were split up per end client. A specific client = always the same tool, and therefore always the same TM. (for some clients two TMs, for two source languages)
- for the glossaries: after some time, I compiled one big general glossary (which contains general commercial and technical vocabulary, terminology that I always want to have with me, things I always forget, etc.). This one, called AA, has been copied into all the tools. The others are client specific, and therefore tool specific.
- when translating PDF files, I sometimes open one of these tools for Context searches.
Problems:
- online tools: one cannot open the online tool belonging to client A when working for client B !!! (for using the TM, the glossary or context searches)!!!
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Balasubramaniam L.
India
Local time: 04:19
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER | I have faced this issue too | Nov 5, 2012 |
I mostly use trados, but have a couple of clients who insist on me using memoq, and one each asking me to use Across and XTM. There are several others who have their own proprietary translation tools.
Since I cannot afford to loose any of these clients, I have no option but to comply with the client requests.
Apart from the cost implications where the different CAT tools are priced products (trados and memoq are; Across and XTM are free as of now), there is the issue of... See more I mostly use trados, but have a couple of clients who insist on me using memoq, and one each asking me to use Across and XTM. There are several others who have their own proprietary translation tools.
Since I cannot afford to loose any of these clients, I have no option but to comply with the client requests.
Apart from the cost implications where the different CAT tools are priced products (trados and memoq are; Across and XTM are free as of now), there is the issue of split TMs. Fortunately, the tmx format for TMs seems to be universal and compatible across most of the CAT tools - at least, trados, memoq and Across can import into their TMs tmx files.
But I am not that much troubled by the split TM issue, because I maintain separate TMs for each client, though admittedly this is not the most efficient way of doing things. So if a client prefers memoq, I maintain a TM in memoq for him and do all his work in memoq.
But I agree switching between CAT tools is a headache and the ideal situation would be to use one CAT tool for all your projects. But it seems to me that this ideal is a bit utopian given the nature of freelance work where we work for many masters. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Balasubramaniam L.
India
Local time: 04:19
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER | Thanks for this tip... | Nov 5, 2012 |
Paola Slajmer wrote:
To overcome the various language variant in the TM (for example, the agency from the UK sends me TMs in the EN-UK-IT pair, while the one from the US sends them in the EN-US-IT pair) you can open the TMX with notepad and find/replace EN-US to EN-UK or vice versa.
That is a nice tip, Paola, I always face this problem of TMs in EN-UK not importing into TMs in EN-US and vice versa. I will try this the next time I face this problem.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 00:49
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| My title should summarise my main point | Nov 5, 2012 |
Tzviya Levin wrote:
Some translation companies are not happy to dixcover that I'm not using the tool for which their files are intended (like TTX for TagEditor of Trados or TXML for WordFast) and in the case of a technical problem they immediately blame it on my tool.
Well, I can understand that. I believe that if a translator chooses to use a tool that his client did not prescribe, then the translator has the responsibility to ensure that the work conforms to the formats and standards as it would have if the translator had used the client's tool.
Some other companies have asked me to start using a cloud tool (XTM). ... Working with two tools will cause splitting of my TMs and glossaries, which will be different for each tool.
Well, a problem with an online tool is often that you have less or no control over which resources you use for the translation. You often can't create and maintain your own glossaries and you can't maintain your own TMs or process the existing TMs to suit your translation style. You have no control over whether the TMs and glossaries are outdated, and you are restricted in to what degree you can mix the client's TM with your own TMs from previous jobs.
I think you should just admit to yourself (and possibly also to your client) that if you have to use the online tool, then you can't be as good or as efficient a translator as you would otherwise be able to be.
I have client who use a number of different CAT tools (some online, some offline) and I have learnt to keep careful track of the TMs and glossaries they send me, because I have to convert it to my own CAT tool's formats (and sometimes I have to convert it back as well).
When it comes to online CAT tools, I usually try to convert the relevant files to offline formats, then translate it with my own CAT tool, and then insert the translation into the online tool again. Doing so takes time, however, and I find that for short jobs the time it takes to do the conversion is often too long (for the amount of money paid), so for short jobs I simply use the online system directly, knowing that the client won't get the same precision as he would have gotten for longer jobs that I translate in my own CAT tool.
I have one client who uses Google Translate Toolkit, and if the jobs are short (e.g. less than 1000 words), I simply use GTT itself, but if the jobs are longer, I extract the translatable text from GTT, translate it in my own CAT tool, and then insert the translation back into GTT afterwards. The increase in speed and precision that I get from using my own CAT tool more makes up for any time spent extracting the source text and inserting the translation again.
I realise, however, that not all online tools are friendly to such a procedure, and not all translators are capable of implementing it either.
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