| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | Stuff Every Good Translator Already Knows Thread poster: Jeff Whittaker
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| yes, I'd say NEVER change the formatting | Jul 4, 2005 |
of an electronic file... although other extras (e.g. pointing out any errors in the original) are usually appreciated.
Of course, if you've only got a paper or scanned version, don't kill yourself to try and find the original font and size used for each word or section, but do at least keep bold as bold, italics as italics, capitals as capitals and adjust the font to larger and smaller.
| | | | lien
Netherlands
Local time: 09:32
English to French
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| self promotion | Jul 4, 2005 |
Aleksandr Okunev wrote:
Avoid, as one member of another translators' community put it, "shameless self-promotion on the forums" and stuff like that, the good old law of 'actions speaking louder than words' works on the Internet too. (See my remark above about idiots.)
How true ! This didn't deter someone to just do that...at length
[Edited at 2005-07-05 10:05]
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Jane Lamb-Ruiz (X) 
French to English
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| Every client is different | Jul 5, 2005 |
Ergo, many things follow from that. But I don't feel like writing a book on the subject..
What I will say is that good translation deserves decent payment.
| | | | Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 09:32
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
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SITE LOCALIZER | any suugestions for "Stuff every good agency already knows" | Jul 5, 2005 |
... where's the other side of the coin (g)?
Somebody pls come out and write it up the same way Jeff did.
smo
[Edited at 2005-07-05 05:30]
| | | | | Translators are writers | Jul 5, 2005 |
This is a fantastic set of guidelines for translators, Jeff. Thank you very much. I'd say you've covered almost everything, but I think one statement is incomplete:
6) Read everything that is available to you - forums on Proz, translation newsgroups, textbooks on translation, etc.
A translator is above all else a writer. Writers need to read voraciously to improve their own writing, and writers/translators should not only read about translation and subjects they specialize in to become and stay informed but should read strictly for the purpose of becoming better writers themselves. Good writers read good writers.
"One way to improve your writing is to improve your reading diet.
Find writers who write well (and who are known as great writers) and read every day. When you read, take your time. Notice how the author put ideas into sentences. Listen to the language, the pacing, and phrasing.
Over time, you'll learn a lot about writing that way."
mcguffin
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum44/1174.htm
[Edited at 2005-07-05 05:45]
[Edited at 2005-07-05 05:47]
[Edited at 2005-07-05 06:13]
[Edited at 2005-07-05 06:16]
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Aleksandr Okunev (X)
Local time: 10:32
English to Russian
| Here's one thread | Jul 5, 2005 |
Vito Smolej wrote: Somebody pls come out and write it up the same way Jeff did.
Not exactly as you described, but quite close
http://www.proz.com/post/133043
Cheers,
Aleksandr
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| | | | Sormane Gomes
United States
Local time: 03:32
Portuguese to English
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| Excellent advice. | Jul 5, 2005 |
Kim Metzger wrote: A translator is above all else a writer. Writers need to read voraciously to improve their own writing, and writers/translators should not only read about translation and subjects they specialize in to become and stay informed but should read strictly for the purpose of becoming better writers themselves. Good writers read good writers. "One way to improve your writing is to improve your reading diet. Find writers who write well (and who are known as great writers) and read every day. When you read, take your time. Notice how the author put ideas into sentences. Listen to the language, the pacing, and phrasing. Over time, you'll learn a lot about writing that way." mcguffin http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum44/1174.htm
Excellent advice, Kim.
| | | | Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 09:32
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
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SITE LOCALIZER | "A translator is above all else a writer. " - I disagree | Jul 5, 2005 |
we're go-betweens. If the original is ghastly, well, I do my darn best to keep it this way. I don't drop or add words or "make sentences better". I try to think isomorphic.
smo
[Edited at 2005-07-05 15:52]
| | | | Angela Arnone
Local time: 09:32
Member (2004)
Italian to English
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| And run the risk of the client telling you the work is bad? | Jul 5, 2005 |
Whilst I understand your position Vito, I can't help thinking this will end up exploding in the translator's face.
I work with all sorts of rubbish source (and when I say rubbish, I mean unrecyclable poisonous waste) but I wouldn't dream of not turning in a grammatically correct, imaginative and readable piece of work that I can hope to be proud of.
If a translation is rejected or criticised, it really isn't going to be enough to say "the source was poor".
If the source is bad... See more Whilst I understand your position Vito, I can't help thinking this will end up exploding in the translator's face.
I work with all sorts of rubbish source (and when I say rubbish, I mean unrecyclable poisonous waste) but I wouldn't dream of not turning in a grammatically correct, imaginative and readable piece of work that I can hope to be proud of.
If a translation is rejected or criticised, it really isn't going to be enough to say "the source was poor".
If the source is bad, I point it out to the customer, before I send back the translation ... and I nitpick endlessly about spelling, grammar, construction, punctuation, so they know that I have analyzed the text and I'm not just making excuses about the quality of what I turn in.
If I'm feeling particularly vicious I simply say "I recommend you re-read your source because it contains a number of errors" but I don't tell them what they are!
To the clever clogs who told me their end customer (a trendy fashion website) wanted translations to sound like original native writer text, I replied that in that case the source should also sound like original native writer text and in their case it rarely did ... what's sauce for the goose ....
[quote]Vito Smolej wrote:
we're go-betweens. If the original is ghastly, well, I do my darn best to keep it this way. I don't drop or add words or "make sentences better". I try to think isomorphic.
quote] ▲ Collapse
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Marc P (X)
Local time: 09:32
German to English
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| "A translator is above all else a writer. " - I disagree | Jul 5, 2005 |
Vito Smolej wrote:
If the original is ghastly, well, I do my darn best to keep it this way.
How refreshingly honest.
Marc
| | | | Almir Comor MITI
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:32
Member (2004)
English to Croatian
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| Agree with Angela | Jul 6, 2005 |
Vito Smolej wrote:
we're go-betweens. If the original is ghastly, well, I do my darn best to keep it this way. I don't drop or add words or "make sentences better". I try to think isomorphic.
smo
[Edited at 2005-07-05 15:52]
Hi guys,
Interesting discussion.
I agree with Angela. I don't refrain from fixing the original if that will help put the message across clearly. It probably depends on who you're working for. If you receive a file from an agency and it's of poor quality, then I can understand raising this issue, but I would still not provide a poorly written translation. However…
I hold a full-time position and I translate every day eight hours a day for a lady who wants to be able to fully understand everything she reads, no matter how poor the original was. My priority is to convey the full message from the original regardless of the original being barely intelligible sometimes (and I encounter these often as I frequently do stuff written by accountants and auditors – no offense meant to them, of course). There are also times when I use the "garbage-in-garbage-out" routine, but this is when I believe the poor form is also an important part of the message. However, if my client is interested in a clear and perfectly understandable translation, I do my darn best to give them what they want.
There's a really good book where this point is discussed at length between a university professor and a seasoned professional translator-translation manager at the European Commission who often has to "fight the fog," as they say, i.e. she has to fix poorly written originals by producing perfectly legible translations. The book is "Can Theory Help Translators?" by Andrew Chesterman and Emma Wagner (St. Jerome Publishing, Manchester, UK).
Almir
[Edited at 2005-07-06 00:34]
| | | | Pablo Roufogalis (X)
Colombia
Local time: 02:32
English to Spanish
| A lawyer I met once... | Jul 7, 2005 |
Vito Smolej wrote:
we're go-betweens. If the original is ghastly, well, I do my darn best to keep it this way. I don't drop or add words or "make sentences better". I try to think isomorphic.
[Edited at 2005-07-05 15:52]
A lawyer I met once told me he would tailor his written arguments to the particular judge, as he wouldn't want to write something that would fly above his head and confuse him or worse, create resentment.
Same with translations. If the original is bad maybe the customer won't realize the translation is better. Pearls before swine.
When I got into the business 11 years ago I would put a note in my bids indicating that the translated version (full desktop publishing up to the mechanicals for printing) would be exactly as the original. Not only it sounded great for the customer but also served as a way to limit capricious changes after completion. "Better" is in the mind of the beholder and that is a fact of life; what you wouldn't want is to fall into a trap that would force you redo parts of a job for free, specially when you strongly feel your version is better.
Other stuff: I admire translations that seem written in the target language. I strive to do that but I have a lot of development ahead to reach that point. And I've found that it prompts continuous rewriting in the anguished (but often joyful) search for the perfect phrases.
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