| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17] > | The global TM I want... Thread poster: Felipe Gútiez Velasco
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| Re: I'd like some of what you're smoking | Sep 1, 2008 |
Kevin Lossner wrote:
This Utopian line has been around since before my grandfather's time...
And apparently lives on. In my opinion, dreaming is a basic need of mankind. But my dreams follow other lines, like propagation of liberty, justice and human rights. Before we aim to destroy "Big Evil Corporation, Inc.", let's work to make sure that all human beings enjoy the liberty and safety we enjoy in democratic countries but rarely value.
(Sorry if this sounded political. I am only defending human rights, which are not at all politics... or so I believe).
[Edited at 2008-09-01 09:17]
| | | | | You need the things, but not the companies in the current form | Sep 1, 2008 |
Tomás Cano Binder wrote: Felipe Gútiez wrote:
Do you think Siemens, Toyota or Sony will last forever?....ja, ja. Siemens: Founded in 1847. And in good health as leaders in many areas. It has survived 160 years and 2 World Wars. Sony: Founded in 1945, and apparently in good health. Toyota: Founded in 1933. Survived one World War. And in very good health. Daimler (makers of Mercedes-Benz, Smart, Evobus...): Founded in 1903. Survived 2 World Wars. In good health as leaders in many kinds of vehicles. BASF: Founded in 1865. Survived counless German crisis and 2 World Wars. And in very good health as a leader in many industries. Microsoft: Founded in 1975 and in very good health apparently. IBM: Founded in 1888 (in 1911 with its current form). And in very good health. Do you sincerely think these companies will be unable to survive the era of collaboration and Internet? They have survived most recent catastrophies of mankind. Will Internet ruin them? I don't think so...  Let's not forget that the world is not only software and Web contents. We need to have clothes > textiles > chemicals > farmers > tractors > more chemicals > mechanical components > plastics > rubber > metals > mineral transformation > mining... and I could be branching forever!!! Most of these products and activities require big investments and a solid management. Will collaboration provide the money and the management of any big industry or human activity? There must be companies who specialise in tons of industries just because you need a coat in winter. Will collaboration produce coats, buses, trains, wind generators, solar panels, tyres, CDs, fruit, bread, meat, socks? It won't I'm affraid... 
Indeed, what big corporations today actually do is buy, assemble, do lots of marketing and sell.
You can create assemble firms and marketing firms who do this and you don´t need the big corporations any more. It is that simple.
[Editado a las 2008-09-01 09:30]
| | | | | You are missing a lot of the picture | Sep 1, 2008 |
Felipe Gútiez wrote:
Indeed, what big corporations today actually do is buy, assemble, do lots of marketing and sell. You can create assemble firms and marketing firms who do this and you don´t need the big corporations any more. It is that simple.
Do you think a company like Siemens, Daimler or BASF (for whom I have worked over here in Spain as an IT person) only buys components, assembles them and does a lot of marketing?
Honestly Felipe, I sincerely think that you are missing the big picture about the lyfecycle of products and services and are only looking at the last stages, only 25% of the effort. I sincerely believe that you will have to work in a big corporation for a while to better understand their activity and involvement in the advancement of technology and society. Please excuse me for not trying to help you understand. This is something you have to do on your own.
It is somewhat cheeky that you are complaining about big corporations when they are the only ones who had the money and the management capabilities required to invent and further develop many of the products you enjoy today, like your mobile phone, your computer, your fridge, the paint of your walls, the bus you use to go downtown, the fuel of your bus, the tractor used to grow the vegetables you eat, the chemicals used to grow and protect crops... It's so naïve Felipe!
[Edited at 2008-09-01 09:48]
| | | | | A possible solution... | Sep 1, 2008 |
Idea: to unify competition and collaboration
Corporation A has an idea/improvement.
Corporation A gives the idea/improvement to the competitors.
Corporation A receives a percentage of the wins with the idea.
Corporation B has an idea/improvement.
Corporation B gives the idea/improvement to competitor B and the others.
Corporation A obtains gains from improvement suggested by competitor A.
Corporation A pays a part of gains to corporation B.
... See more Idea: to unify competition and collaboration
Corporation A has an idea/improvement.
Corporation A gives the idea/improvement to the competitors.
Corporation A receives a percentage of the wins with the idea.
Corporation B has an idea/improvement.
Corporation B gives the idea/improvement to competitor B and the others.
Corporation A obtains gains from improvement suggested by competitor A.
Corporation A pays a part of gains to corporation B.
In that way, there is an incentive for corporations to compete and to collaborate.
The first step for global collaboration could be the global TM.
[Editado a las 2008-09-01 10:15]
Don´t you see it? Translators in a globalized world will be the stars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Everybody will need us!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Editado a las 2008-09-01 10:16] ▲ Collapse
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| I just used to take "mate de coca, from Bolivia", je, je | Sep 1, 2008 |
[quote]Kevin Lossner wrote:
I'd like some of what you're smoking 8:29am
[quote]
| | | | Samuel Murray 
Netherlands
Local time: 21:35
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| My comments I | Sep 1, 2008 |
Felipe Gútiez wrote:
-There should be some kind of remuneration for uploading and for correcting TUs (translation units).
-There should be some kind of remuneration for adding new terms or new translation of terms.
I would be in favour of a system where there is no remuneration at all, and translators pay a certain amount for the upkeep of the site and for improvements in design and for other costs associated with making the service useful.
You might ask, what incentive would translators have to share their TMs if there is no remuneration? Well, this is why I'm in favour of a social networking type of site where small groups of translators benefit from each other's presence and from each others' experience, instead of royalties on content.
But I'm open to argument.
| | | | | Not my cup of tea | Sep 1, 2008 |
Oh my. Sorry buddies, but maybe I should have ignored this posting altogether. I thought we were about to discuss a serious matter here. In order to achieve success in today's business environment, I think that a good knowledge of economy and companies, some notion of law and an ethical approach to life are needed.
Without these things in our pocket, we are just being naïve and playing around with ideas about how we will make our life a paradise... Daydreaming and discussing what j... See more Oh my. Sorry buddies, but maybe I should have ignored this posting altogether. I thought we were about to discuss a serious matter here. In order to achieve success in today's business environment, I think that a good knowledge of economy and companies, some notion of law and an ethical approach to life are needed.
Without these things in our pocket, we are just being naïve and playing around with ideas about how we will make our life a paradise... Daydreaming and discussing what jolly and smashing bunch we make is completely OK with me, but it will not take us anywhere... ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Tomás, it is serious, if your want drop it out is your decision... | Sep 1, 2008 |
We have enough staff in this thread to start a business.
I would like it to be something like MCC, a cooperative.
They show that it is possible to dream and make dreams true.
Ikea did not exist 50 years ago, and his founder was one year in prison.
So, who want start?
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| Don´t forget, the key of this business is the knowledge of you, experienced translators | Sep 1, 2008 |
You can decide if Logoport is succesful or if a cooperative of translators is succesful.
| | | | | | | Interesting approach | Sep 1, 2008 |
Samuel Murray wrote: Felipe Gútiez wrote:
-There should be some kind of remuneration for uploading and for correcting TUs (translation units).
-There should be some kind of remuneration for adding new terms or new translation of terms. I would be in favour of a system where there is no remuneration at all, and translators pay a certain amount for the upkeep of the site and for improvements in design and for other costs associated with making the service useful. You might ask, what incentive would translators have to share their TMs if there is no remuneration? Well, this is why I'm in favour of a social networking type of site where small groups of translators benefit from each other's presence and from each others' experience, instead of royalties on content. But I'm open to argument.
May be just be remunerated for correcting TUs, so that TMs with more than 5 corrections can be eliminated screening by creator. In that way we could have a very useful way of keeping the memory clean. There must be more alternatives.
Any suggestion?
| | | | | A global TM where translators gain visibility | Sep 2, 2008 |
If I want to hire a translator I have into account:
-KudoZ(by the way, what a horrible name, isn`t it?) punctuation?
What about TUs translated, verifiable in a global TM?
What about TUs corrected and approved by other ProZ members, verifiable in a global TM?
If I don´t mind of my source text being published publicly, because it is already published in Internet (for example a user manual), why should I be basically against a TM with my source and target lang... See more If I want to hire a translator I have into account:
-KudoZ(by the way, what a horrible name, isn`t it?) punctuation?
What about TUs translated, verifiable in a global TM?
What about TUs corrected and approved by other ProZ members, verifiable in a global TM?
If I don´t mind of my source text being published publicly, because it is already published in Internet (for example a user manual), why should I be basically against a TM with my source and target language feeding a global TM?
Why has Logoport failed (apparently)? Because the power is in the hands of the translators, the good ones. You cannot bypass translators brains in this business.
Why not create a company á la MCC, where translators are owners? First you pay, then you are owner, then you take risks, finally you take part in the benefits and can take part in the decisions.
Who will be interested in this kind of venture? ▲ Collapse
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Nicolette Scholte (X)
Local time: 21:35
English to Dutch
+ ...
| This whole thread... | Sep 2, 2008 |
Makes me sick to my stomach!
Yes, it does!
And why?
Because it seems, that 'our' Felipe here wants some free advice, so he can set up a company (by means of an investor, as he is looking for in an earlier topic from a few days ago), make a giant TM with free (or with a tiny fee) from translators who earn a living by translating the words that he wants to put in his TM.
He also wants to enlist the help of an IT technician, a lawyer and what-not, who he either will ... See more Makes me sick to my stomach!
Yes, it does!
And why?
Because it seems, that 'our' Felipe here wants some free advice, so he can set up a company (by means of an investor, as he is looking for in an earlier topic from a few days ago), make a giant TM with free (or with a tiny fee) from translators who earn a living by translating the words that he wants to put in his TM.
He also wants to enlist the help of an IT technician, a lawyer and what-not, who he either will use for free or for a small fee, as a freelancer of course, not as an employee (I know, this was not stated, but my own words/thoughts, and I dare to bet that they aren't far from the truth).
He then wants to make this TM and sell it, so other translators will probably need to buy it for an X amount of money plus pay $30 dollar a month to be able to use it.
In short, he wants to make a lot of money for things that most (note the word most!) translators don't even need/want or are a copy of already existing software/services on the net.
He is the one who will earn money out of this and laugh his (well you know what) off because people 'helped' him with virtually anything and he gets his steady supply of money in!
I'm not even talking about the legal side which has been discussed for almost 8 of the 10 pages of this topics' length.
Well Felipe, you wanted a summary of your thread, well here is my view of it!
I for one, am not interested in buying your programme, or giving you advice (which I would normally very generously give, as I'm a nice person ) ▲ Collapse
| | | | | I hope this "summary" from Nicolette motivates people to read the whole thread and think... | Sep 2, 2008 |
1+1=2
2+2=4 and the like
Please, just read the thread. I promise I will make a summary if nobody else want it to do.
[Editado a las 2008-09-02 11:55]
[Editado a las 2008-09-02 12:00]
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 21:35
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| I don't mind... | Sep 2, 2008 |
Nicolette Scholte wrote:
Because it seems, that 'our' Felipe here wants some free advice, so he can set up a company (by means of an investor, as he is looking for in an earlier topic from a few days ago), make a giant TM with free (or with a tiny fee) from translators who earn a living by translating the words that he wants to put in his TM.
I don't mind. If a business person wants to know from us translators what our needs are so that he can create a product that we are likely to buy, then I don't see any problem with it. In fact, I support it. How else will business people know what product developments to invest in that will add value to the translation industry?
None of us will buy something if we don't want to, and we are likely to buy something only if it has value for us. If Mr Business Person wants to improve his chances of commercial success by sounding out his target market, to ensure that he doesn't create a useless product that is eventually either shelved or propped up with trivial incentives, surely we should applaud that approach, don't you agree?
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